Ottawa Palyul Dharma Centre 4 June 2011
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stranger canada western Canada He worked here and he married a Canadian from her alberta, but he was going in arizona now now in purchased from. At the room mountains it's not far away from Too tucson. We we even and they bed breakfast last four. Their places situated in marine remote and deep Canyon, a mathematics drop and donor formations. That's where the Indian, you know, chili cookies. Stronghold against army. End the the nineteen century. And koi is very there, but nobody knows the exact location of his grave.
It is a great honor to introduce Jon eight. Is a scientist, practice meditation almost fourteen years. Which is weekly class to some and leads privately treat for small groups as is retreat center in country follow. Into took or coordination as a dedicated life. Thirty some years ago and trained in both and had to tibetan karma career traditions. Is a great teacher. In southeast there's nothing like more than discussing the dha with people who are genuinely interested. He particularly likes answer questions, next.
I think kind said that if you keep silent, you might be thought. But if you open your mask you just the case manage questions. And so during the stew retreat of the jar Do my use of considerable with them. He is really a master navigator of the mind. That's fine. Thank you very much. Thank you. That's a very great pleasure to be here. And I great honor, and I really appreciate. So far, the members of your sound good that I heard had I really enjoyed a wonderful feel group. So Yeah. I I hope that I have something to offer this helpful to you.
Okay. I I do like best answering questions. But because then I know what people are interested in. And it creates a a dialogue creates smart an energy. But I realized too that I need to start things off. So so that it triggers the questions that you have in your mind. So the topic that we chose for this weekend was John. That's that's a poly word and the corresponding word in sounds, very similar job. And when buddhism isn't went to China, John became Chime. And then when was went from China to Japan it became zoom.
So there's an interesting thing that in North America, we quite familiar with many aspects of buddhism. But it's unusual to find very many practitioners who are at all familiar with the practice of giants. And of those that Are familiar with it. There's a lot of this understanding. For example, you know, I mentioned to you the der database for the Japanese word is in from with the word John. There's there's very few people that know about And those that do would probably assume the meditation that is practiced as being within the tradition.
Be very different from John. So... Thank you very much. So at the very least, we should begin by clarifying what the John is are and and and addressing any any of the ideas that you may have hired along the way as to what john are and what role they like. So The word, as I say, the poly Genre. It actually comes from another Poly word j opt. And the general meaning of Jonah could be taken to be just simply meditation. And should you spend some time producing the? What he'll discover is that John, the the word John appears through over and over again.
Most of the discussion of meditation includes numerous references to China. The definitions, there are there are several different levels of And the definitions of those levels of Appear over and over again, including the the definition of of Sun samadhi or right. Is the description of before the first four form, Channels. So We have... We we didn't have john's being almost synonymous meditation. And the sutra. And if you look at the... If you're familiar with the story of the Buddha life, he left home.
Have the first teachers that he went to And doctor. Taught meditation, and he mastered the most advanced meditation practices. Of those two teachers, which were the two highest of the form jobs. This tells us several things. It tells us that John practice preceded the buddha himself was already established in in India at that time. And of course, the the buddha himself became very skilled in the practice of John very early in his search for enlightenment. But if you are familiar with those stories, you'll know that with both of these teachers, Basically, he said, so is that it?
Is that all you gotta teach? This is really nice, but it's not what I was looking for. And so he continued from there, and then he took up a number of other seated practices and various references and sutra as we can that he studied with the what what became the giant tradition and a number of different traditions. He also practices practiced austerity in a very strict and very severe rate. Let him have led him to the point where he realized that this wasn't the was darn to do it and he would withdrew from those practices.
And then in his own words, he says he recalls and event as a child. During... Believe it was a plowing ceremony that his father was performing. And has a board child he he played with his mind as a result of which he entered John. And he reflected on that. And you can imagine at this point he's really... He's tried all of these different things stand about seven years or different teachers trying many different things. And he's determined to to find the answer to his questions. He's determined to find the practices and the path will lead to those answers.
And this memory comes. What we know what he said that has been carried down to us in the speeches. He says, I recollect that. And I ask myself. Could this be the path Yes. It is the time. And he made another telling comment right after that. He so I need not fear the majority and pleasure associated with this practice. So very interesting. Thing. A thing to keep in mind in terms of what you sometimes hear people say about San practice and the practice of The John nowadays. Anyway, he sat down. Practice the in practice the John in such way.
That he achieved and enlightenment that fairly short period of time. So that's the story of the buddhist enlightenment. That after his enlightenment, he went out to teach what he had learned. And the practice that he talked over and over again. Telling. And up to a certain point in time, John practice was pretty much synonymous with boost night meditation. This reflect fair moment how different that is from what we find today. We find that have been developed any other practices. You'd look at the Zen practice.
We look at the past our practice of the It's very popular in Southeast Asia, Mah style loading practice and the practice start fight. I in the tibetan tradition. There is the analytical meditation on hampton emptiness, which is practice as a part of the union of insight and log. The sound practices, which are the precursor to mah mud and to tan practices. There a huge variety of meditation methods that have evolved today. And of them of the as they've come to the west, many of these have become quite popular, but what is the one that is most singular haves from My call Buddhist toolbox today.
It's the practice of the John. Very strange? Client's too much effort. It requires too much effort. That is a very good comment. Very appropriate. Because Here we should look more closely at what the Johns are from an historical perspective. Because yes. If you look at how the John are described in the t tradition, you find they're described on the basis. Of a text that was generated many centuries after the Buddha Called of facility mara. And it outlines the genres in such a way that they truly seen are almost impossible to achieve.
If you look into the tibetan tradition, you find the same thing. They don't refer to the city manga. But if you look have the text dealing with meditation. They describe John in such a way. Well, For example, to enter the first child of the prerequisite for entering a first John is to achieve a state of access concentration, where you are capable of complete withdrawal of the mind from the census? No. So that makes it that's a pretty big hurdle me. Right? And from that point of view, it's gets small one than people, you know, there gotta be an easier way.
But that... How does that make sense to us I mean that everybody back in the time voodoo was just a natural born, better medi. Than just moved. Not much to do. They sit down after a couple of days. Withdraw their mind from the senses and going into anti John. Right? I don't think so. I don't think so at all. I think there there is a tendency in these things too. To make them more fabulous, more fantastic or just more and more. And, of course, the result of that is eventually becomes un unreachable.
But to a certain degree, that's happened with the whole concept of attainment of the goals of the blue path. It's been spoken of for hundreds and hundreds of generations in such a way that reached the point where it's hard to believe that this is something that's attainable by any human being little on me. Right? I a feeling. Yep. In the state, has he went around teaching, people were experiencing a awakening right in the left stream entry right through r naught. Just, you know, apparently according Citrix thing is one contract held at Walter peak, which was attempted by one thousand two hundred and fifty are hot.
And that wasn't all of them. That was just the ones that came. So. So just like enlightenment methods itself I think we need to consider whether that the description that understanding of Genres that we have now is is accurate. Is and maybe some of the notions attached to it are doing us a disservice, but making that which we aspire to so greatly seem so difficult to obtain. In let's go back to just the fact that give the earliest literature. Jonathan seemed to be synonymous with meditation. And that's a general use.
So what we can say about that they probably weren't referring to meditation in the sense of somebody who's still novice and learning. Somebody who sits down. And keeps forgetting what they're doing and getting lost in a long period of mind longer. He's not talking about that. But I think that when I use the word jonathan to refer to meditation. They're talking about a level of meditation where a person can consistently fairly consistently all these exceptions, but it can't consistently sit down.
And sustained attention to the meditation object for the chosen period meditation. Which if we look at some of the other teachings on meditation, is actually pretty much defined when a person cease to be in all and starts to be a. Are you familiar with the with the stages of meditation, any of interview? What's that? Dangerous and john? No Not the stages of John on the stages of. The stages of of the cultivation of well, we would call concentration and writing for us. Surviving and start to. They're originally laid out by the buddha itself and a few sutra that you're probably familiar with.
They all say the same thing that Kaye got to Sa sutra and the Scientific Sutra. And the side time what's the one main. This my mind. It means in and out. You hung up on that surface. What's not one thought side. Yes. So all of these include... And the San katana has a very complete sequence of sixteen verses. But you're probably alpha familiar with sorry time got to gone to the forest to the root of the tree an abandoned house or so forth. He sits down with his legs cross. Places his mindfulness before him and mindful A and San he out.
When he breathes in along he knows he freezing in alarm breath reach a long breath and knows preach out of upon. When it breathes in the short breath, he nose and when out the short graphic notes. Experiencing the whole body. As he breathes him. He trains himself. Experiencing the whole body as he breathes out, he trains himself. Calming the bodily formations, As he in, he trains himself call the bodily formations as he health, he trains himself. All of such as I mentioned, I'll start with that same section there.
That section is describing to you what's meant by meditation. And I think we can safely say what's meant by Jonah in the general center first in meditation it is a level of attention stability and my awareness. Where you can fulfill those descriptions. And so that's I think I think what John is referring to in the general sense now more specifically, it means absorption absorption of the aligned into. Meditation object. And And this kind of absorption is not something that's alien to any you. You've all become absorbed in many things many times.
Right? Have the absorption of Jana is not different in inclined. Than any other sort of absorption that you've ever experienced. There are certain ways of this difference. But it's basic basically the same prospect. Where have one way that one way it can be described is to say that. I think bandwidth of your conscious awareness is completely taken up by what you have chosen to be aware of instead of moving around from one thing to another instead of having other things can't turn into that space so you could get.
It's fully occupied or whatever doing. That's what that's what absorption need. And Donna in the more restricted sense means an absorption with the meditation object. Does this sound like something that is feasible and doable for ordinary people. In the stages of meditation, that the Buddha described they were elaborated. Into into nine stages. And are any of you familiar with those? Stages? That's Okay. So and and traditional formulation at those. The first stage is hearing the instruction. Somebody tells you how meditate.
Then in the second stage, what happens is you placed your mind on the meditation place your attention on the meditation object? And we are sure enough after short period of time. You should forget what you're doing. And then your mind takes a little round the world cruise. And some period later it could be anywhere from a minute or of two to ten minutes. Do you have a sub utilization at well? That's not what I was not what I'm here to dear. That's the second stage. The third stage, you developed enough skill that your mind will stay on the meditation object for longer periods of time before you lose in.
And the periods when you've lost attempt to be short. If you're blind wander, it doesn't wander for far or as long. And when you come back, one standard that sometimes has offered I I take this really... It is very loosely. But if you you're able to keep your mind on the object, for the amount of time that you could go around a model of a hundred and eight beads with a short mantra like one money pipe. Right. So if you know about how long that is, that's that's not a terribly long time, but it's significantly longer than what when you first begin.
So your your meditation there it looks like, you know, periods of attention and then these little gaps and other you to be attention little gaps. And so that that third stage call the stage attach... Attaching the matching the gaps. Trying you're working to. Those up. The first stage that you come to them is where you... There are no more gaps. You never completely lose the meditation object. It's always in your in your awareness. Not necessarily the primary focus of your attention, but you haven't lost it completely.
Yeah Now these nine stages are defined in the Northern India by yan tradition. They're not spelled out the same way in the terror out tradition. But in the t body tradition, you can certainly recognize something alien medication obstruction. And this is the point at which a person is no longer novice. And you can sit down for a period of an hour. You never really lose a meditation object. I keep in eye. When I say deborah, if you've had some really events in your life, And you said down meditate take...
It's not gonna be like that. But when in general, when you sit down to meditate you can sit down for a period of forty five minutes or an hour and month lose meditation object. Then you can say you... You're no longer beginner you now. You're you're now meditating. Now in that four stage, what happens? There are, of course A lot of other things going on in your mind. You're aware of bodily sensations are sometimes they take the form of pain and. There may be external things like sounds and smells.
There's most definitely a lot of blocked memories motions and things like that kinda get going. So in that four stage, all that stuff is there. And what happens sometimes is that one of these other things will predominantly over the meditation object. You know, lose some meditation i object that. But it's slipped side a little bit centers stages now people qualify by out some thought or some distraction. Call that a gross distraction. Right? All of those things when they stay in the background. And your focus on medication object, call them subtle distraction.
So in the first stage, what you're working on is The problem is... Well, half of the problem I should say, I'll kind the yeah. But the first the problem is that although you don't lose a meditation object, it's not always at the focus of your attention. And that subtle distractions become gross destruction. And so the four stage is involved with working on that problem with the goal being that not that you eliminate the subtle distractions because at the stage you can't But that you that they don't become gross distractions that they remain in the background.
While focus with your attention on the meditation. The other half of the problem at this stage is dull. And you know, where you sit there. And and all of a sudden, there's the realize that you redo on. Or they are very close to dosing on. So that would be an example of very strong dol. There's another... Well and that strong dull is preceded by a more subtle bonus. You're meditating the focus of your attention and meditation object. But first, it's not as clear. It loses its the sharpness, the vivid clarity perception of the object.
And if you don't recognize that that is happening, then it's it's going to progress what get work. And then you'll come to a point where meditation object starts to become distorted. It starts to become something other than what it is. And and the next thing after that versus you're starting to fall asleep. So subtle illness become strong all that's this is a major problem in the four stage as well. So this is the other half of what a noted deals with in the fourth stage. Side by side with presenting subtle distractions from the becoming gross distractions is presenting.
Settled all from the kind strong donors. And in many ways, these are two very different things. The account sort of opposite places in the mine. The agitated mind produces much more of way of distraction and is more easily distract. And the d energized mind is much more prone their though. So I seem to be coming from very different. But one way you can look at these is that they're really both and they're different manifestations of the same phenomenon, which is scatter of your attention. Retention can scatter either to domino's or to distraction.
And so that's what uni unified them in the first state. As you're trying to. You're trying to overcome the scatter everything. And that's the main work for the four stage. When you've done that, you're right at the fifth stage. So I understand the fifth stage, we need to go back a little bit to the settled on this thing. In the fourth stage, if your mind is agitated, one of the ways you can deal with it is just to back away metaphorically speaking back away from meditation object. Take a much more relaxed perspective, not try so hard.
And if you do that, it helps to stabilize your attention and you don't... And you're not distracted is either. Found that yours you probably discovered that on your own if nobody's ever talking to. Now when you do that, settled on can rise and as a kind of sold on this. That instead of progressing to strong dull. It can be be sustained. And in the fourth stage, you don't mind that. You actually make use of that. When your mind is agitated, you allow that settled illness to develop. Which it does very easily.
Because at this point, you're so familiar with the meditation object that it's the brad. Cell familiar with it that? It's very easy to let that energy level drop them down to a more comfortable while. And that subtle illness can be sustained. And the fifth stage is about overcoming that so dollars, which is very important because if you if you become skilled at sustaining the sleep state of subtle illness, you'll think you're having an excellent meditation. Your your attention doesn't move away from meditation object.
You trained yourself not to go into strong dogs. So for the whole period set, you you say gee I'm sitting here And so single point and focused is great. But if you're doing that in the state of subtle don't, it's not gonna go anywhere. It's gonna stay that's as far as you're gonna go. You're going to have very relaxing pleasant meditations. Point out to you that your skill not increasing. So you'll have recurring struggles to sustain that as different things happen in your life. She'll never go forward.
You're struggling to keep the same place because it's all dependent upon the state of subtle dull, and there is no future in that. But That state fits the description of single point focused attention wonderfully well. But it's totally lacking is it does not fit the description of mindful awareness. And that's the problem. So fifth stage is all about overcoming settled bonus and increasing the power of mine awareness, which is what you need to do to move on in the practice to subsequent stages. So at the first stage is the stage that In in many ways, if you skip it it it becomes a attractive.
It's a very important one to to keep in mind. But if you overcome the tendency for subtle illness and you train your mind, one way I think to describe the goal is to train your mind so that from the time you sit down until your meditation is ended, rather than the quality of your mindful awareness, the quality of your alertness, diminishing as it has tuned to do. Instead, it increases. At the very least it doesn't decrease. But in the course of doing this practice, you'll find that it increases.
And by the end of the sit, your mind is actually sharper. Clearer your perception is more vivid. Than it was when you begin. And that brings us to the sixth state. In the six stage, your situation is your minor is sharp affair. You can hold your attention on the meditation out there. But your mind is still full of this background of thoughts and sensations and things like that. The subtle distractions are still there. So it overcome the gross distractions a strong dull in stage four. We overcome the subtle elements in stage five.
Now it's time to confront the subtle distractions. And I'll point out to you that a big mistake that people make meditation, whether they're doing with pasta or and else. Is they try it to be single pointed too soon. They try to eliminate the subtle distractions. That's that is a a terrible mistake. At the very least, it's very very frustrating because you don't have the skills you can't do that. As a matter of fact, if it's not really possible for the part of the conscious part of your mind, that generates intentions like that to actually produce that result.
So it's only frustrating trial. And of course, by trying to do that By trying to withdraw your awareness too much from everything else that is present. You make yourself extremely vulnerable to both dull and distraction. One of the experiences the beginning medi have, you sell them well focus on this meditation object and try not to forget about and show it's built be really single pointed on it. And that'll be great to breath. Two, three breaths and boom their gone, and they can't even remember what happened.
Because when you become too focused, something comes some font or whatever comes out of your subconscious just my Discoveries that attention is preoccupied or something that is totally unimportant. Kicks it out right, then. Whereas if you sustain if you sustained a broader awareness a personal awareness. You can become aware of these things. As as they arise how the subconscious has an interesting kind I know you'd have this experience, if been meditating. Interesting fonts or memories or or so forth they arise.
And if you recognize that, and you nice the danger to eight percent. You refocus your attention and you allow them to evaporate. But if you're not aware, if you don't see them, though right and they'll take over. So I was a little bit of a digress, but the medi One of the real values of the description of learning to meditate by stages is that it tells you what you need to work on at each point. And also you understand it properly it tells you the things that you shouldn't try to do is it's not the time to try to do them yet.
And they'll okay create a problem. But when you get to the six stage, you're ready now to work on eliminating the subtle distractions. And when you've done that, you can prescribe the quality your Medi state as a single point. A very interesting word. Point. Because your attention is focused on a single thing. And essentially if we if if I were to describe what that is like. There are very few thoughts and the thoughts that are present are very much in the background. Why and and analogy is you're you're talking to a friend and you are aware of the traffic on the street.
But it does... It has no ability to capture your attention either... It's not i'm gonna interrupt your thought to turn around... Look at the best bands. You just know what's there and you let it go. And so the thoughts are infrequent, and they're more like somebody else's conversation in the distance. You're aware of bodily sensations and external sounds that only the ones that are truly prominent. Most of them, your are are are not going to register very clearly. And that's that single point. It's not meditation teachers illustrate that by saying.
Think of a about, you know, resolve a smaller picture around. But just the one big thing you're focused on on. I found it very interesting to go back to the poly and see what the word is. I gets translated by meditation teachers as single pointed. And it's got. And the number one is. And gut means volunteered to. Going. Got the got needs gone to one. And the word... What's translated is single pointed is she does echo got, which is the mine that is gone to what. And I don't believe I've probably become very convinced over the years as a result of my own practice and teaching other people and Then going back and looking at those techs, that is not what that means.
It means unification of mind. Because in the sixth stage where you develop this. Yes it does get the description of single pointed mask. But if it's even better, a description of unification of mine. This is the beginning of unification of on unification of mine becomes much more strongly developed from this point onward. So if you think about it, it's as though you're not in your mind is not one thing. It's many different things. Many different parts to not. Many different processes. And and they have different goals and objectives.
You sit down to meditate and one part of your mind just decided this is a good thing to do. But there all these other parts of your mind to have different ideas. K. And you train your mind? Then you get to the sixth stage i hear you are you you you you've trained your mind to stay on the notation object. But there's all list other stuff keeps coming up in the background. That is the problem six stage. Is it coming from? Well, if you think about it, it's very yet. It fits the discussion very well.
Of all these other parts of your mind that are still doing their own thing and waiting for you to get finished with this meditation nonsense so that they get there. Date in the sun so to speak. Where as you practice and work your way through this, it is as though all these different parts of your mind are now. Getting on track with the same goal, the same program. As the item becomes more unified. There are fewer distractions the the part of your mind is responsible for processing auditory information.
Isn't taking every sound that comes out and say, hey, Let's look at this one. It's it's saying yeah That really has nothing to do with what we're doing now or we're meditate. And it's, it's only something really unusual that I'm. Same thing with bodily sensation. Have the same thing with thoughts. I suspect that the thinking process never cease. I suspect that we think subconsciously fonts are going on all the time. You know, how the answers is to problems should show up. I don't know where you can't remember something.
So you do else then it comes up. So there... There are many different things that suggest that that but thinking processes and not just one multiple thinking processes are going on pretty much continuously and non conscious little bit. So so. And these thoughts and in memories and experiences and images and things like that to show up in meditation. They're counting from that sub subconscious. And they're they're rising fully formed as a result of those processes. So the way that that becomes tamed is when more and more of the totality of your mind.
Gets to be on track with the same project rather than processing some other problem or situation or whatever and then looking for an opportunity to thrust it in conscious awareness. So that's why I think that the best translation that got is not single pointed, but it is unification of mine. Heather what? Meditation teachers tell you that you're doing just trying to become so focused on one thing that everything else falls away. Is a great method That's a great practice for bringing about identification in mind.
But once the mind is unified, you don't need to do that anymore. It's no longer necessary it can be completely dispensed slip. And that's that's where this practice is going configuration in my. When you worked your way through the six days, you arrived at the seventh stage. The mine is becoming unified. And I'll just sort of quickly go through these other stages because I think I have chance to talk about later. And I wanna get back to the process and we're on it fits into this. You have the seventh stage.
Your meditation, although it has there's a very high quality requires. Constant vigilance and you need to take action every time either distractions begin to rise again or dull, you need to be vigilant for those and you need to take corrective action. They're easy to deal with. Your mind is so well trained that it's not a problem at all to to keep distraction and darkness from arising. If you notice it, but requires constant vigilance, and this is the habit that has been developed up to the seventh stage.
And what you have to do there is you have to you have to exercise that vigilance, make those corrections. Until you reach the point where it's no longer necessary. The mind is so well trained that is no longer necessary. But it's now such a strong habit. Very difficult to that door. So the problem in in a seven stage is It's a funny one. It... At first it's the problem of needing to be vigilant and to take action. Until the mine gets sufficiently well trained, the effort is no longer required. And then this other half of the problem is learning to stop making the effort after it's no longer necessary.
There is one description of meditation breaks the process down into. Five problems. And the last two problems are the the next to the last problem is the problem of not doing. You have to have that vigilance because if you don't, you're gonna lose you're gonna lose quality in meditation. The fifth problem the one the follow that is the problem of doing. Once the mine reaches the point where effortless concentration is possible. You have to stop making the effort. Because it is two degree agitated and disturbing to the line.
When you do that, you achieved effortless concentration. And there is a state of P developed, Pt is a poly. Means joy. Original result meaning of it as joyous as in the same kind joy that you have whenever you get good news about something. But this one that is not dependent upon external circumstances arises internal as a result of unification of mind, Biden me to go into that more at some part. But When when you have seen this unification of mind when your practice becomes effort, Pt arrives. Although it needs joy, there there a number con con with Pt.
Physical sensations and the body sounds that you hear a white that appears behind your those eyelids and so forth. It's all part of Pg. But that brings you to the eighth stage and eight stage is really about getting to the point where you reach where where T is fully developed. And by big fully developed you work through all these other. So lights and the sounds and the weird sensations and the the jerk and the twitch chains and the leaking six inches off the cushion suddenly is a burst of energy goes up spine.
The lot of fun that happens in united states. But when Pt is fully developed, then it is predominantly a mental state of joy. And it's accompanied by a physical state, pleasure but not by all these other your feelings and sensations. While the light might still be there because you don't pay much attention to it anymore. It might be a ringing or buzzing any years but don't pay attention to it didn't anymore. And all the strange sensations have done for everybody is just the pleasant feeling. And all the jerky and tri and jumping is gone, and you may have a strong sense of the energy, the inner winds moving and your body circulate.
But it's not disturbing. It's actually... It has a peaceful of. Yeah. It's it's it comes like a subtle laboratory phenomenon. Then the next stage is about. Well, just to one way these describe. Okay. Is that What we talked about in the sixth and seven stage was achieving mental clients or your mind does what it wants. That as a physical with the full development of Pt. You have physical clients in the sense that you could sit for three, four, five, six hours quite easily. And the other thing that's very interesting about is when you get up, you're know, Gonna find that your leg is asleep or that your joints were sorry.
Long job. If anything, you feel very when you go. Then the... As as the Ptc cease the visa so much a physical phenomena and becomes a meth funnel phenomenon. There is bliss of mental. The is the pleasure in the body is implicit physical landscape, and the state of joy and the mind and the happiness to the companies added is is faking a mental plan. And you come to the ninth stage and the night stage, the intensity and energy of this Pt subside. Called subside mental and physical buoyancy. It leads to a state of tranquility.
So in the night stage, you can very easily each time you sit down, focus your mind bring the Pt when it come to stated maturation and then allow the process of subside, which is kind of getting used to. It's kind of getting over being. So excited and distracted about this amazing wonderful thing that you manage to accomplish and. And as a tranquility develops, you move into the tenth and final stage which is characterized either the one have by the tremendous amount of identity e of summertime time.
And then on the other hand, by the fact that when you get up from a meditation. You don't really lose the State you're in right away. The concentration, the mindfulness, the joy, tranquility and stay. At first, maybe they only stay for half an hour an hour. Later on, they'll stay right until the next time you sit down to meditate. So each time you sit down to meditate, you're just kinda charging up the same state which you're able to take with you all in the time. So that is that is the process medi process of summertime.
Almost any form of meditation practice fits into the scheme. Actually it's described as it it has the stages of developing summertime. But it's actually pretty much a universal description of the process of mental cultivation. It includes all of the ingredients, not just concentration, but mindfulness. And of first, concentration mindfulness, joy, tranquility and e activity are five of the seven enlightenment factors you're familiar with. The other two are investigation and word that we can translate this energy or diligence, might say diligence, diligent investigation, which is what leads to inside.
And so that would... So you have those last two enlightenment factors to summertime. And the result is inside the way. Now let's go back to John. Probably when Done is used as a general term to name meditation and a John. Is a medi. That you can apply that term probably to anyone who is at stage four or beyond. They're no longer and another. But in stages four and five, if you were to try to enter into an, In other words, but differently, if you were to try to become single pointed prematurely What you're gonna find is every time you do that, you either totally forget what you're doing and you're back at stage two on laundering.
Or else you're slipping into very strong dull, sinking and it's hard to be an. But at stage six, you can actually enter into absorption. And you can append to a form of John and practice from that stage. You can become at that stage. The problem is At that stage, you have an overcome subtle distraction so you need sort of a device to help you. Saturate the bandwidth of your mind with one chosen object of attention. And if you recall, you in the buddhist description, he said, experiencing the whole body he and.
That's the trains himself experiencing the whole body it breeze out. Does he change himself. If you do that, in other words case you... If you've been doing breath meditation, the sensation of the breath and the nose or sensations of breath of abdomen. If you intentionally expand that to the whole body, It will require the total bandwidth of your consciously awareness to take that. And you can go into an absorption that state. And as a matter of fact doing so we'll only enhance and improve the quality of your meditation.
And accelerate your progress through the subsequent stages. So that's the earliest point i would China and the more restricted sense are a focused sort state can be achieved and utilized. But from that point on, you can practice on it. What we would say you would be doing now is using the sixth stage of summertime has access concentration for the others. If as you progress, you can use the seventh stage also is access for the Job. And they are a deeper form of more profound absorption. And i likewise each of subsequent stages after that.
I'm talking enough it's time for you absent some questions lisa things. Yes. To you how you open overcome of this stage to the social stage? How you do that? Yes. Well, yes. I can give you... I i I well I I'll i'll I'll describe to you practice is very helpful and. But first, let me just point out to you what what the challenge is. Have you ever had an experience that was very intense. Maybe a dangerous experience where your mind shifted into a state of ultra clear awareness. Very powerful short if you ever have that experience.
Can't press your finger on it. But it sounds familiar. What about... You find yourself in a situation where there's the potential for some reward for gaining something that you want. And you notice your your... The energy level of your mind goes up a few notches and you're much more acutely aware. I likewise it's this danger, anything like this. You're mind... Your mind is capable of a much higher degree of awareness than what we normally experience. And of course, we know the other end too. We those times when.
We just kind of space out when we're very unaware and course alcohol and lack of sleep and things like that can reduce that as well. So It kind of a imagine is just Spectrum at one end is sleep. At the other end is is an extremely high state of of conscious acuity. As a matter of fact that's what athletes refer to as being in result. And normally we're functioning somewhere in the build. Maybe often somewhere in the lower middle. So with meditation with focusing your attention on some object that has become extremely familiar.
And has long ago lost much and any inherent interest it might have had. There's a tendency of the energy level on the mine to fall and the acuity and your awareness your account. So what you have to do to train your mind not to do this. Right? Is to create a kind of challenge if forces forces is your mind to move to a higher energy level and forces the mind to access more of the resources of consciousness. That are already intrinsically inherently available. And so one simple method for doing that.
This this is a method that It's actually the precursor to what I described you doing in the six days where where you're observing the the whole mess the the whole body with the breath. And that is to shift your attention to different parts of the body. Like, at the nose the sensation the breath are really clear the abdomen they're really clear and to chest their reason way clear your shoulders there's some sensations related to the breath with their faint. And so on. But you can't shift your attention around a different parts of your body.
Examined very very closely what sensations are present in that part of your body. While keeping an awareness of the breath itself at the nose of the abdomen sort of in the background and trying to answer or any of the sensations, for example, we put your attention on your left up your arms. Are any of the sensations that I had monitoring about after to upper? Are any of these changing was there or any of them related to the drug? And so that's a practice that forces bind to move to a higher level of appeal.
And as you do that practice, what you'll end up discovering is that indeed, there are sensations that change with the direct. Right down to, you know, your toes and your scalp and and every part of your body. And that those are there and that you're capable of detecting them isn't really what this is about although it's. It's very wonderful. Amazing. But it's about is you can detect them. But you you need to give your mind the challenge and then you need to do the practice in. And damn, you will overcome that tendency.
To for the bite to swift them federal on. All of these things are about training your mind. They just like your your money is just like, training a dog. You just kinda do the same thing over in a already. Correct it when it doesn't do right? And give it a reward when it does because things well. And after a while, it that's what he wanted to do. So it's just a question of choosing the right task for the training. And you want to overcome the tendency to dull. Any task that you can come up with that forces your mind to utilize a higher level of conscious awareness.
We'll serve the purpose. And so What I just described is the way that I was taught and that I teach other people to do and people find it works extremely well. But I've had other people come up with their own you don't. And if you understand the the principle, that you can invent your own technique, to bring it about. But that's what you need to do to overcome the tendency to dull and and seven stage are in the fifth phase. There is another factor to it I I should mention since you. You have to be able to recognize subtle dollars.
And that's a skill. At first, you will not recognize it. You won't recognize all this until become quite strong. But in in the fourth stage in the process of intentionally, overcoming strong. You keep looking at your mind to see whether you see any evidence of all. A result of that is you begin to detect subtle and subtle forms of don't as they right. So by the time you get to the fifth stage, you've already got a really good start on being able to recognize some of all when it's there. But that is something you need to continue to work on.
Have... As far as recognizing dalton goes, we have lots of lots of opportunity your practice should involve being mindful as much of your day as possible. When you go to sleep at night, you can bridge so much about all in the different stages of don't by watching your line and you go sleep but night. It's really useful. But likewise at other times during the day too. And you know, if you listen to somebody in it warren darn talking watch others stuff Yes. John Describing because it's... I. You know, just trying you know, that realize the sensation and not only in the the main parts of the body, you know, not brass does, but in so some of the suburb approach like and in the extremities.
It's like a scan kind Yes. Can well is. Yeah. And you can actually you transcript it but really transferring into those areas or actually, it's getting there anyway. You just leave more some percent of words, but it's still magic like the stage. And That's right. You're you're... As you sharpen in your mind and then you focus on. And you just discover all kinds of things and and they're not coming into being. They've been there all the time. Yeah. It just joined. He's just never noticed them before.
You know, what was necessary. And I'll tell you, in my own case, I have Phd and physiology and talking sciences. And so with certain things, certain things always bring about a certain degree of skepticism. And I had this skepticism. About product chakra, chi, men's. I did find it interesting that so many different cultures described something similar. But then maybe part of what threw me off is that some some of the western hers who discovered these eastern traditions pulled down anatomy books and trying to relate the chakra to the the parasympathetic nerve system practices and things log that.
And with the scientific background, do you look at that and me say That's utter nonsense. This is true. He has nothing to idea with that. I have I had a really strong skepticism system about these things until when I was doing this practice, and I began to feel sensations these kinds of energy sensations i you say right down to my toes and things like that. And then the more... I practices these the more I became aware that these were currents of energy that are moving back and forth and different direction.
And the more in my practice, I became aware of these, the more I realize this is exactly what all of these different systems have been describing. So when you do this practice, you will become familiar with these energy movements of the body. And later on when P arrives they become really, really strong. And become disruptive least. One of the nice things about becoming familiar with them early on online is that It's a lot easier to work with them and I our less destructive figure not. They have There's two big...
I i find, not an expert on this other people who pay a lot of attention to this, and this is necessary... What I've discovered in passing about this but two directional kinds of movement to the energy. One of which is the first one that you discover if you're doing this practice, which is from the core out to the periphery the energy goes at out. Comes back in way white. And you discover it by looking for sensations that change with the breadth. But interestingly enough it's not it's out of phase with.
There's there's a time this energy moves in and out. So that's one directional component. And the other directional component which doesn't become a apparent until later on is one that is of movement primarily up to spy. Steve And if that's the first one that you experience, and it suddenly comes on really stronger, it can be really difficult to deal with. Very, very difficult. Very disturbing and painful if there any blocks movement of that energy it produce severe pain things on that. Mh. But that one...
If you are aware of i work with the movement from according to the periphery. Then when the movement cut the spine counts, you can work with that much more easily. And what eventually happens is that energy begins to flow strongly up vanity obstruction. It comes right up to the crown, and then it just showers your body with. It's like the energy moves through your body as a as a form a pleasant sensation. On its way up, it can be painful. But as it comes down it's like a shower replace. Doesn't matter right there's a form of pt, there's five different forms of Pt what was called shower and Pt t.
Energy comes up. You know, it's you know there's juice coolers. I don't know they still have with like it goes up and then it comes that. It's it's like that. It feels just like that. It's very nice. And then of course, over time these movements of energy as I say they become much more placid and less disturbing Would be up down the vertical pink that you got described. Would that be... It couldn't go in the the? Yes. It is. Right. Yeah. Like i say, I'm not an expert on this. I read to put my you may...
Some of you may be familiar as a book by an Indian man who experienced an unexpected rising of con and a meditation with a little bit for concept or etcetera problem. Copy Krishna. This is nathan. And i read that book. You know, after I experienced all this, I I quite a few years after that. I came across it. But i'd read it. And what I feel like happened to him is that Somehow he opened up this current all at once with no preliminary, you know, and it was just... It was almost more than his what he could handle this minor but think was more than his psycho entity deal with.
And so whenever I hear descriptions of could lady energy it makes me sort of suspect that those practices are somehow leading to a sudden abrupt vertical rising of energy, which is not the only way that it can happen. And Chi gong and tai chi and things like that. I they deliberately work on moving the energy in other directions rather than coming down. So it is the same energy. It's a couldn't billing the energy not share of it. Yes. Would you agree, John that some of the confusion and basis for skepticism in the western line regarding breath and and energy is due to the English word breath.
Because the language, other languages such as that use language like chi or pronouns or it tibetan lungs those words are associated with energy and not just You the breath that goes into lungs. Because when we speak about breath, we're saying, okay. I read then it goes to my lungs. It's not going to my knee like that That isn't where that breakfast going. And and so we got skepticism why we talk about oh field breath and your name. Well, no. You know But But the the word is what is the sort because the energy is associated with that with that flow, but not it exactly.
That's yes. I I agree that is that is the problem. We'd actually be better off they were a little more naive if we didn't know about lungs. Yeah. I always breath is when it goes can go anywhere. Yes. Nine stages. More kind of related to the. Yep But you're also mentioning something that sounds like cheaper that could be by. So I just... Okay. No. Actually, these they that particular description in stages is part of my tradition. And you know, I I don't I don't think particularly in terms of hit yada bah.
You know, I mean, quite honestly, I think that is. Mostly, I i as sort of distinction and just develop for the for the sake of those people are stuck in a place where it might waste better than ways Oh. It's been there's been attempts made to turn it into something a little more wholesome than that by saying that... Well, these are all levels and you have to you have to master the hidden on it before you can really undertaken about Hay and they have to master that before moved to Austria. And there is some truth about But unfortunately, he still leaves us with the idea that there all these different these different paths.
And I have... I have to really force myself to see them in that way anymore, because they're really not. I it it is true. That until you have completely overcome the inherent sensor cell. Everything you do is going to be conditioned by the perception of the world divided into self and other. So recognize that and we're then positive way. Not only that. Until you have transcend ego, attachment to the personality view of these. Correct Until you done that. All of your motivation is going to come from fulfilling your desires and avoiding your fears.
So work with that? Don't deny it. You know? It's like I A question i come of so often is... Well, if if desires bad thing that what i'm disarm get lightning somehow right now. We're all kinds of things. So if if you can just focus reasonable that of that desire and becoming enlightened instead of all this sort of stuff you're aware. That's. Kind. And it's instead of. Or when you speak about I got the mine gone to one mess. Would you say that it is not only the, you know, various aspects of mine which are unified.
But also mind unified with the object of meditation? Well, You're good. Say that. But I I I mean, really the question is when we come across term, is that what the people originally using it had in mind? And that I'm not entirely sure it would be true. I can't say that it isn't. But you know, unification of mine is one of the descriptive characteristic of all of the Vagina. And yeah, it's something that is also present even and there is not that same degree of absorption. I know object is still.
Yeah. When the object still. It's very strongly realistic of trying everybody. Sorry observe right. Yeah. Right. So So I I... That's the only reason that I question that mh. It seems like the idea of the of the absorption or fulfill that aspect of it so. So for somebody who is just kinda starting Out or has been to more but five by night. Mh. What would be a kind of recommendation that you would have in terms of Obviously, you know, we... As was part of this i, we are practicing dev adriana and we are doing some virtual practices on a regular basis this.
And so on top of that, I'm personally trying to practice some of this grieving meditation and trying to get concentrated and trying to get to these places that you're coughing about. What would you recommend for somebody? Because it's probably like, you know, you hear different things, ten minutes here there, Do it on this. There's just so many options. So if you really kind of wanted to go step by step here, what would be something that would be with. If you wanted to go step by step, I, if you really wanted to go step by myself.
I would recommend that you put a major focus on developing a certain degree or concentration in line from somebody samadhi and saw. And that's your priority and you never let that any other practices. Take away from your new dedication to doing that? Because once you do that, all your other practices are going to take on. You can you can't develop a degree of Samadhi. Doing visualizations. But it's sort of read... It's the hardest way to do it. Is really It's it's much easier to to use those methods that have been developed tested tried and true.
For for cultivating samadhi and then take you then apply them to visualization practices. So that would be my suggestion. Right. Java. Seems to be where you be quiet that you achieve and Ts. Where you acquired? Seems... No. Know They on... No. That's... Yes. They present. But they're acquired before that. They are present as a part of... Well... Okay. Let me back up a little bit. If you our practicing Jana starting from the six stage where there is no pt. Then your first experience of Pt will be when you succeed in entering first time, Pt will be there.
But if you start from... If if you practice John from the seventh stage. Usually, you can elicit enough p they use the Pt to enter it the first time. And for... So the P arises as a part of Outlook the the summit practice. Okay. With the deeper genres where you're using stronger concentration as your access, the Pt and computer. But what confuses me the second use a supposed... They're open to be P or. Yes. Yes. That's right. So we about cash waving too. Yes. Right. Being the first on after which speaking by I knew you're supposed to close the.
But by the third by the third john, and you've lost the Pt. Yeah. And the second john you have pt and Su by, how I long we talk it, which are... Yeah. Yeah. But i. Yeah. By the third john Pt not there. Yeah. Quiet all the john the thinking not be did. Yeah. Fantastic answer. Yeah. I'm That's that's right. Do to enter the third john you intentionally let go of Pt and focus on. So now. Because brought that up, I'm just... You know, I I'd I'd love to answer you in a lot of detail but I thinking we haven't really talked about the John and the jonathan manufacturers and the ones that are present in a different Jobs.
And I don't want to leave everybody else sort puzzled wondering. But I know we'll get that. Maybe could you hold on to this? And talk about it more when we get to. Where everybody can be a part of our conversation? I hope. Otherwise, we we'll have it on i. Just you. Okay. So I think you had a question Is it possible for blink One a better way. What's secondary faster than a second. Is possible to have any have experienced in the processes of elements of all the nine steps. Whether faster slower second Is it possible because I have a feeling is a feeling so deep that I can't explain it in any way, And is it possible to have elements of all nine even if the one's not consist that we one stage of any other taking time?
I'm not. Totally sure I understand you, but let me try. Are you asking is it possible to have experiences corresponding to any one of these lines just from time to time. Yes. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. And that's that's not at all unusual. As you as you practice, you're you're bound to have experiences corresponding to stages that you haven't. Actually reached out. Okay. And it can be quite amazing when somebody never meditate before it, you know, they started practicing in, like, two weeks into it there they they have an experience.
It doesn't last very long, but it's it's full blown Pd of stage eight. You know? And But the important thing to remember is those are wonderful they give you and give you a sense of what's come. They let you know what your capable was possible. But it's being able to create the causes and conditions consistently so you can do this all of the time. So so when you have those, it's good to say, oh, That was really nice. Thank you. Now I go back to work. So I get to where I have that long time. Thank you.
And somewhat related to that is wherever you are on this on this progression, you're gonna find yourself moving back and forth it. You know you know, it's not like you you're hear. It's not like a staircase where it's one step, but it's right you sort of move back and forth over range. But the general trend is always going farther forward we and not a start path. Yeah. I'm just wondering. If you find yourself in a state of emotional upset for whatever reason. Is it a more benefit to sit and do your regular practice and try to overcome it or is it a more benefit to wait until the upset passes so that if you're beginning, you could sit and and feel so you're accomplishing a better recommendation.
You're you're better off in many ways. Practicing even though you're in the state of my emotional. But you might modify your practice in certain ways. In order to take into account the notion state you're in. An important part of this is learning to deal. Emotional stays. I guess why we all would like to be able to do any angry integrate. But as your mind, they have more calm the quiet as a result of the practice. You're gonna have all kinds of stuff come up that you thought was long gone or that you didn't even know you were turning around.
And so the practice itself involves dealing with intense promotions. But I think you're talking about if you have a situation that puts you into a rate term and natural term. The best thing that you can do for your general state of mind is to keep practicing. And the best thing that you can do for your practice is to learn as much as you can about how to deal with promotions and make that So I I guess how to put this. To sit down and to be really upset about something and say, well, I've better not matter today because I'm too upset.
I would never recommend that. I. We recommend that you drop all expectations of, you know, maybe your quality of your meditation with such and such not gonna be that now. So drop all our expectations. Don't worry about your notation in that term. But do your practice. And an important aspect of of doing this practice properly, is that you're you're cultivating and your sustaining an intros awareness of what's going on in your mind. Even I sort of met a cognitive type awareness where you're kinda standing back you're observing your own mind, but from i somewhat more objective.
Vantage point. And that's extremely helpful. When when you up sir? It's extremely difficult, but it's also extremely helpful. And so to to degree, that you can do that. If I do... If you have a meditation and you do nothing other then watch the emotions arise, and watch the thoughts arise, and keep yourself at that objective distance. And that is the practice because what is not the practice is you get lost in those thoughts. You get lost in those emotions, you identify with But to the degree that you make your work to be, okay, these are arising.
I'm not gonna fight against it. I'm not going to let myself. Get sucked into it. Identify it it. That's a good practice. Sometimes that's impossible. And all it's gonna happen is you're going to get sucked in and you're you're gonna get lost. That's a really good time to switch from saving practice to walking meditation. It's a good time to put all of your focus on the sensations in your body. Mh. The easiest way to deal with emotions is to begin sensation. So there are ways there are ways to deal with that.
But abandoning the practice is not not Okay. Fast for. Yeah. Following this line of thought, John. You you spoke earlier, I think regarding growth instructions that when you sit to meditate, then you know, as you just had all kinds of memories or or or maybe things that you didn't realize about yourself or your relationship with somebody else from whatever come up. And in the practice, as as So I've been taught then one acknowledges one one notes one and then one goes back to the task of, whatever one is doing too.
But I've noticed that in our western context, there there is a a a sort a feeling or sense that No. If something comes out that I, you know, feel is very important to or something that I didn't know about myself or whatever. I must now this is it's not just not getting sucked into it. I I must actually really deal with this now. And I must kind of investigate this and and deal with that. And this is from pharma cyber therapy. If it's coming from that perspective. What what do you have to they or how... you know, what the comment we can make on that?
This is something that very commonly happens Starting particularly around the fourth stage is you'll have profound psychological insights into yourself your past through the behavior your tendencies, things like that. And and they tend to be terribly important things. Right yeah you know, I I can't just turn away from this one. Or. I've been... I've been dealing with this problem for all my life now. Now I'm starting my content... In forefront front of my consciousness now I must really deal with it.
Alright. So the guideline that I would use If you can't turn away from it. Then you can You can't go. There's no point in trying to ignore something and then failing and then surrendering. So you... What you want to do is what it is to have whatever you're paying attention to, you're doing on purpose, You're doing it intentionally. Okay. So these thoughts are coming, try to keep us an objective perspective as you can. And the most important thing is that... Let let that part of that right. Run its course, but don't find yourself looking for more and i'm looking for another one what does that lead to and things like that?
Because it does, it turns into... It becomes like western and psychotherapy, which you have to go back for over and over and over again. And you're piece trying to deal with all of these things. So, usually there's some kind of a not in there or some genuine and Right And all that you really need to do is to take a good fur hold of that. Look at that So I to think about this a whole lot more later on, you know, and then go back to doing what caused us to come up in the first but. Because there's a lot more behind that.
There's more stuff to come, but it's not gonna come if you're if you get into of doing self analysis every time you sit down, they don't sign to happen and a person do doubt. But but that is the danger. The the clarity of your mind, You've made... You you've opened up the past for path for things that have been buried to come up. And so there is a temptation to do more with them than you need to. And the answer is to to be really clear in yourself that He want to avoid getting caught up and analysis.
You want to grateful accept whatever gift is being offered. And you can take it and work with it as much as you want other time. But but don't kill the goose they late the golden by getting caught up and And this happens very easily. But in the state of clarity, sometimes it will be, you know, insights into the dha teaching. And it's like, oh I never understood that before. And so... And said here for forty five minutes, just, you know, thinking about... That's called analytical meditation. It's a wonderful thing to do.
But don't do it when you're when you're supposed to be doing some about practice. What your mind does get every... If you do this, your mind will start coming up with more and more things. And these things that comes up with they'll have an emotional tone to them. I have the same emotional term. The same, oh well this is really important. But if you reflect on them, you'll find that a lot of them aren't they you know, retrospect retrospective obviously, waste their time. And so you you've got to be firm with your right.
My to me fire your mind? So particular commentary that my head. Particular commentary I have to, you know, it depend a lot on what kind of meditation you're doing. The... In terms of what's in English, the set of commentaries on mah major practice are really really good. The light of bah mud. And this one buy something named Brown. Anyway, These books deal with meditation they and particularly deal with summer. We had a very healthy way. An interesting thing about a book Mud if It's that thick. At least the first half is not more is on some this.
But so many people buy to book and they skip that. And they start meeting and the section of not. Of the some of the best stuff. And and to use to use any of it. Should it should begin with the sign of the talk. So yeah. I'll think about that. But definitely, if you get the the light modern mo, and wish my memory names was better. Can't remember the name of by lam. Or the name of Which time? Quite. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. That's the one. That's Yeah. Kind of... Yeah... Yes. Trying to that like can't trying to replicate shit.
Yes. Extremely good. He's got a lot of good on. Yeah. Actually, thank you for pointing out that connection between us. You say the book on mah home where the first half is not showing that because I think not maybe sounds much a number of on practitioners and wish they the visualization practice is so is so prevalent the signing of practice is so prevalent, but many practitioners don't realize that in fact there really isn't any visualization practice coming up properly without the s. Basis without the ability to enter into those stages of absorption.
Yes. That is true. Really important. So again, from my experience for the last year that I've been working on this daily. Like, when I was on holiday and I'm in retreat or it's just so much easier to get to a place of absorption and to familiarize myself with the the various stages. And then I come back to work and life is busy, and and it's not even that it's emotionally afflicted or anything, but it's just so busy. And it almost takes me so much more time before I can even get to a place where you know, like, I can actually breathe and actually key in my body, and then I don't have time.
You know, it's like... And so that... That's a bit of frustration for me that, you know, living in multi world functioning, high functioning, know people that we are to kind of, you know, be committed and how to maintain that through when you're frustrated. Like, I'm extremely frustrated because I'm sitting there for ten minutes or, you know, and I'm not even close to getting to a place where I'm actually in my body. And and then, you know, then I I kind of have this sense of... Oh it's not worth it, you know, I shouldn't do it and what's ten minutes or what's twenty minutes, you know, and I can't get to in twenty with.
There's this kind of obstacles that then arise mental obstacles that arise from this just kind of monday mundane, relative world living. Any suggestions or chimps now. Holders. And how. Yes. And that's that's what we are. And i... That's who buddhism is trying to be dealing was it the rest is household. No. No. Alright. So it's really important. Think to address. The first thing is this is a very basic thing, which is dropped expectations. You know, it is so easy as you say go on and retreat. You have these really profound experiences, tremendous meditation and you read great depth with concentration, you experience brilliant mindfulness list.
And then you compare that with you sit down to meditate and you got all the stuff on your mind. And for ten, fifteen minutes, it's just, you know, all what started is circulating. But if you drop the expectations, let's say, whatever is happening have my meditation, is perfect. Right? So doing the best you can to practice. Now especially this is true doing a solid kind of practice. Just being aware of the distractions and every time you feel yourself the away bringing yourself back. That is the word.
And you can even look at it in a positive line. That if I sat down here and in the space of ten minutes, i only have a dozen distracting font. I wouldn't get my real practice and. I wouldn't be exercising the skills to the same degree. So if even what kind is being a positive thing, all this agitation. It's like, lifting bigger rates, right here also is stronger. So worked on... Judge, c to compare ce to have their expectation and making it your goal. To just do practice in the best way you can right now, whatever's happening.
And that will pay off for you in a way. And thank you and? Just. The main method the of to keep your attention on the on a patient of object. Yes. It's... So... Because some kind means serenity. And that serenity derive more than anything else from developing the ability to stop the constant movement of attachment. So calling the mind, still in the mind all of these terms. Referring to the fact that our attention is normally going everywhere. And if we can anchor my place say still all kinds of things change.
So that is that is the essence of sa is the serene mind the mind that obliged you called us because the attention has come under control. Which is not to say that you are limited limiting in any way, the peripheral awareness, that you have. Because Although part of the practice that I described to you, involves a kind of single pointed concentration. All you're doing is learning to control learning to have intentional control over basically the scope of your attention, as well as the movements of your attention.
Sub means stabilizing the attention and and regulating what it includes and what it doesn't. But there's a whole other aspect of awareness. That you're not trying to live it, you're actually trying to expand. So you are trying to change the direction. Everybody following me, you know, attention, one thing you pay attention to one thing, but you're aware other things at the same time peripheral milligrams. Okay. Normally, our peripheral awareness is occupied by all kinds of external things. When you sit down to meditate, initially, that's true.
Your peripheral awareness, while you're focusing your attention, your peripheral awareness is still taking in barley sensations so, you know, stiff shoulder, and itch sounds outside, you know, smells coming from the kitchen, whatever. You don't want to eliminate that peripheral awareness. You actually wanna intensify it. But you want to redirect it away from the sounds and smells and sensations in your body. To what is going on in your mind. So second is a line where the you the attention and it becomes very still.
But what's going on in mind also becomes very clear. That picture. So that's that's the other aspect of it's not just it's not just quiet the mind. It's also brightening the mind and headed to mind tape itself as primary object. No. What. Trying the same that one as validation. Whether it's down upon the spot or what whatever else you cherry. And it's like that is the main but Okay. And everything comes from that. Yes. And yeah. If I understand you you're saying, yes. That in terms of you as the doe, What's my job as the do is just to keep bringing my attention back to the object.
Because you can't make anything else happen? Is that? Yeah. Simply it's small that I think that the rehabilitation object becomes the main higher. In in the. So medication... Education object. Have the main player. Thing. I I if I understand you correctly, you're saying that the... The process of keeping one's attention on a on an object and whatever it is is the cause and condition for the arising of all other effects whether that defect might be a clarity of awareness or entering into the other Genes or however, that is the primary cause and condition, the ability to hold the mind steady on that on that object.
Yes. That's a reasonable thing interesting. Yeah. That is that that So because I've just got a personally three of. Understanding impact. The main to keep on the meditation seem about talent faculty, and I never do. Did i. So it says you may see awareness Yes. That's. The attention in the middle as well. But but to even him doing that, at the core of it is keeping the attention still because you can't you can't cultivate that peripheral awareness and less your attention is still. And interesting analogy is, you know, with their vision, they focus our eyes on one thing and where eyes are focused when we taking on all kinds of things that are real vision.
But our eyes are moving around our peripheral vision disappears. All we have is that little tiny thing that, you know, where the eyes focus in the end we one moment So it's not grasping the peripheral vision. It it's not grass. It's... Yeah as a matter like It's an interesting kind of thing. If you start working with the peripheral awareness, the natural tendency is to try to grasp with things, which means and what you're doing is you're shifting your attention to some thoughts? And then then it comes a growth.
You know So, you know, if you the... You have to you'd have to not forget that the only way to exercise peripheral awareness is by stabilizing the attention. Otherwise, you're just have attention. So... Yeah. Yes. John do you have a website and it it be the website? Do you describe the nine steps of? Yes. I have would website darn treasure dot org. And and da, s in d h a r m a. Yes. Treasure dot org. And there's a page there on that's writing sign and it says meditation manual, what's called meditation.
I know you can download the description of the stages. I I believe with that the Pb file. So Ollie, you can... Both on John's website, I'm a treasury, you can also... We and downloaded that and put it as reading on the the failed Ottawa website under the specialty events, so there was a that you can get all of. So in both places you can find them. I've never read such in depth breakdown of what united meditation is. Really this nine stages like it was really very liberating to read it.